No, I don't blame him, but at the same time he prob. should have looked at the long term instead of just going "WANT".

I gurantee he would do the same thing if SFGAm was ever available.

Personally I find WOF to be a better park than KI, but then I prob have too much sentimental attachment to WOF to make it a fair judgement on my part.

I agree. It really upsets me that they're considering this. I'd be less upset if they were selling off Carowinds because that was one of the parks they purchased from the whole Paramount deal, and considering that's one of the "lesser" parks in the whole CF chain. It makes me mad because they're possibly giving up 2-3 parks to pay off the bunch they received. I don't see that as fair in my opinion. And to Jason's post, I agree, I would've too, but it's not that easy. He's taking away two of the original Cedar Fair parks. We put the Fair in Fair. (VF does) And Swoosh, I feel the same way about VF. I went on a east coast(er) road trip, and I felt that Dorney outdid Cedar Point, and that KI was a decent, but sorta bland park, Valleyfair being more fun (but that's just me loving VF to death).

I don't think you can say who the 'lesser' parks are until you know the bottom line. For example, and I said it up before, Michigan's Adventure contributes more to the bottom line than almost any other park.

I wouldn't get too upset over the possibility of the parks being sold until you knew who was going to buy them.

I really hope we get a nice company that will take good care of the park.

I hate being busy at work where I miss out on big news 
I hate to hear such news but I can understand.  I also understandof why they may be selling wof and vf, they couldpossibly bring in more cash bc they are worth more. Maybe that is why they are offering them up instead of the lesser parks with no value.  That would explain why Kinzel was at the park the week prior to the tour.  I agree also that they wont shut down wof after the season bc it would be incredibly stupid to shut down a park after a new, high profile ride gets installed.  Depending on who buys the park this could be good or bad, but only time will tell.  This could be a smart sell/buy or an incredible loss to the owners and guests of the park if it gets ran down the tube.....

I am sure that this will all work out in the end, and there is very little to get too worked up about just yet.  Keep in mind they didn't put GL up for sale or anything they just closed it, so I don't think we have to worry to much about closure right now.

I agree with Jennifer, I think a slower economy helps a more local park like WoF.  There are a TON of people here in KC that haven't been to WoF in years.  But as money becomes tighter, WoF will become an ever increasing option.

Cedar Fair needs a government bailout. Write to your Congressman.

Also, I think both of your guarantees are based on wacky assumptions. I'm pretty sure the board doesn't consider the parks based on a popularity contest, if the board had any input into this at all even.

Do you have anything in actual writing to discredit that?
It is a well know fact that Hunts are no longer on the board and the Jourdans are still on the board.

Also apples to oranges with the MIA - CP comparison.  CP is obviously going to have more overhead to deal with.  AND if MIA is such a great park to add to the bottom line, have they recovered their ROI on Thunderhawk yet?  I don't see that happening for another 2 years.

There are seven people on the board, including Mr. Kinzel.

Yes that is the board of directors - or the governoring board.  There are other boards within the company.

...and yes ROI on Thunderhawk does too matter.  There were costs in transporting, prepping the land, repainting, construction among other things.  I highly doubt that it is "paid for" in one season.

Overhead also does too matter.  When adjusting for PNL you have to take that in to account.  Think about it.  It is going to cost more to run Cedar Point for a day then it will to run Michigans Adventure.

Yes "Michigan is Strong" but it is only take a very small percentage of what it costs to run CP to run MIA -- therefore it takes a lot less people to recover those operational costs.

 

I love how everyone thinks they understand how to run a billion dollar business.  None of us do, cause we don't.  What Ken21 is saying makes a lot of sense to me though. 

Yes "Michigan is Strong" but it is only take a very small percentage of what it costs to run CP to run MIA -- therefore it takes a lot less people to recover those operational costs.

I think what ken21 is trying to say is- Cedar Fair gets more dollars back from every dollar put into Michigan as compared to Cedar Point.  Business isn't just about recovering costs it's about making money, and Apparently Michigans Adventure is doing that with a higher Return of Investment then other parks.

I think all this board member talk is irrelevant.  The SOLE job of any board member is to protect the investment for shareholders.  Definitely not to protect there "Hometown" park.

And Besides the Hunts live in Dallas anyway so what do they really care about KC's amusement park.

Yes that is the board of directors - or the governoring board.  There are other boards within the company.

...and yes ROI on Thunderhawk does too matter.  There were costs in transporting, prepping the land, repainting, construction among other things.  I highly doubt that it is "paid for" in one season.

Overhead also does too matter.  When adjusting for PNL you have to take that in to account.  Think about it.  It is going to cost more to run Cedar Point for a day then it will to run Michigans Adventure.

Yes "Michigan is Strong" but it is only take a very small percentage of what it costs to run CP to run MIA -- therefore it takes a lot less people to recover those operational costs.

 

Are you serious with the other board thing? Come on. So your argument is that part of the Jordan family was on a different board than the board of directors, and because of their amounts of family on this magical board, they bullied their way into their park not being on the chopping block. Just so I understand your position.

Also, I know, I am saying overhead doesn't matter in my conclusion that the park that contributes the most to the bottom isn't going to be sold. Whether its new attractions, maintenance, attendance...all that crap doesn't matter when you are presented with the total figure like Ben said...making money. Obviously CP has higher expenses than the other smaller parks, but that isn't a reason to sell or keep it. You see what I'm saying? Its about the bottom dollar at the end of the year, not individual rides or departments.

I think all this board member talk is irrelevant.  The SOLE job of any board member is to protect the investment for shareholders.  Definitely not to protect there "Hometown" park.

I know. That is what I've been trying to say. Swoosh is the one saying the opposite with his guarantee that the seats on the 'other' board had a popularity contest and wof lost out.

While I have long since posting on this site (mainly because I feel it is too focused on SoCal and Robert Niles seems to think Disneyland is THE. BEST. THEME. PARK. EVER!!111!ONE! I do still occasionally read his site just to make sure I don't miss something that another site didn't cover, or was late to the dance.

Either way, some interesting opinions on this: http://www.themeparkinsider.com/flume/200903/1088/

Most Notably:

So the corporation either...
# sells at a fire sale price to an undercapitalized buyer entering the business,
# holds onto the local properties, but slashes expenses and lays people off in an attempt to create an obscene profit, or
# shuts down the profitable local business to play accounting games that might help the corporation.

My only point for bringing this up, is I think the news is more serious for Cedair Fair as a company than people realize.

Let me respond to each one of this concerns on there own.

# sells at a fire sale price to an undercapitalized buyer entering the business,

I don't know how selling off property under market value helps a companies share value, and it obviously won't have a good effect at reducing debt.

# holds onto the local properties, but slashes expenses and lays people off in an attempt to create an obscene profit,

These profits will obviously be seen on a very short term (less than one season) and again I doubt they will do anything to help the company.  And if this is being done to inflate the sale price anyone will be able to see through this move during due diligence. 


# shuts down the profitable local business to play accounting games that might help the corporation.

This would only be done if the properties themselves were hemorrhaging money.  I don't know of any "accounting game" where shutting down profitable business and letting assets wither is good for a balance sheet. 

Another update: Worlds of Fun has changed the name of "Joe Cool's Backyard Barbeque" to just Worlds of Fun Backyard Barbeque.  The website has also removed all references to the Peanuts Character Brunch.  I don't think the park would be quietly removing these character references if they didn't at least somewhat seriously antcipate a sale this season.